Religous debates and questions [2]

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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by chris63 on Wed Dec 14, 2016 11:37 pm


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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by Lancebloke on Thu Dec 15, 2016 7:29 am

He is a clever one....

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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by Amarië on Thu Dec 15, 2016 8:16 am

Urgghhh... I think I saw this on FB and I got about as far into the video then as I did now. About 24 seconds or so. The stupidity hurts my brain, I can't dealt, it's just not worth it.

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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by Lancebloke on Thu Dec 15, 2016 11:57 am

It's quite the irony that he is suggesting everyone who subscribes to the evolution and big bang (and the others he didn't mention) theories are the stupid ones.

And that there are LOTS of people like this!!!
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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by halfwise on Thu Dec 15, 2016 1:22 pm

Yep, and most them are over HERE. Mad

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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Thu Dec 15, 2016 2:13 pm

{{{Best thing Britain ever did- packing all our religious nutters into ships and sending them to the other side of the world Twisted Evil (mind you I don't think anyone thought they'd actually survive! Mad )}}}

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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by Lancebloke on Thu Dec 15, 2016 2:59 pm

We still have plenty of them.

Has anyone ever watched Fern Brittain doing that programme about famous people's lives? She did one about Niger Benn recently (well, I saw it recently).

Towards the end she talked to him about how he finally found god. When she asked him she sounded like she thought this was the superior state of being and Nigel had joined the enlightened club.

So could have punched her if I was in the same room!
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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by Mrs Figg on Thu Dec 15, 2016 4:46 pm

Lancebloke wrote:He is a clever one....



check out the brachycephalic forehead. nuf said.

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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by azriel on Fri Dec 16, 2016 12:46 am

Laughing

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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by chris63 on Fri Dec 23, 2016 6:58 am


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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by Orwell on Sat Dec 24, 2016 7:02 am

Looking at the cup as being half full - or was that a glass, never mind --- looking at the cup half full: war does thin out the population, and as most of the species is either Homo boobiensis or Homo ignoramus - or an ungodly cross breeding, which explains Trump supporters - it may be just as well. (Not ALL Trump supporters, mind. Very Happy )

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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by Mrs Figg on Sat Dec 24, 2016 4:11 pm

when super Volcano Vesuvius plodes, and it will, we might have a good bit of population thinning, I bet it happens before 2016 finishes.

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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by azriel on Sat Dec 24, 2016 11:06 pm

Ooooooer, that gives me the willies pale Incredible things volcano's, & Tsunami's frighten me shitless !

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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by Lancebloke on Thu Jan 05, 2017 7:44 am

Argument against intelligent design... man flu!

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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by chris63 on Fri Feb 17, 2017 4:21 am


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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by chris63 on Thu Mar 02, 2017 7:29 am


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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by azriel on Thu Mar 02, 2017 5:18 pm

Very Happy Well why would they ? they have the backing of Royalty.

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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by halfwise on Thu Mar 02, 2017 6:43 pm

Not here they don't.

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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by Lancebloke on Thu Mar 02, 2017 8:08 pm

Not sure what you are talking about halfy... but it seems churches over there have backing of the federal government and various state authorities too... much more power than royalty.

If that wasn't what was meant... ignore me!
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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by halfwise on Thu Mar 02, 2017 8:26 pm

Historically the Anglican church was an extension of royal power. It may not be exercised these days, but the Monarch is theoretically head of the church of England. The rulings of the general synod must be approved by parliament.

Here all churches are distinctly separate from government (by law) and have been from the beginning.

The government 'support' is in the form of tax-free status as befits a non-profit, has nothing to do with the religious orientation. We wouldn't say the government supports them - quite the opposite - it ignores them!

At least on paper. You wouldn't know from the way many conservatives behave. Mad

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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by Lancebloke on Fri Mar 03, 2017 8:45 am

It ignores individual churches, but not religion as a whole.

And everyone knows the monarchy has no real power in anything!
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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by halfwise on Tue Apr 11, 2017 2:24 pm

A rare article from the Federalist: intellectually wide ranging and rather fun.

http://thefederalist.com/2017/04/10/darwinianism-birthed-secularism-actually-favors-religiosity/

There's nothing new in here, but has an engaging way of pointing out atheists are the victim of their own Darwinism: religious folk tend to out-breed them.

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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by Eldorion on Tue Apr 11, 2017 8:39 pm

Oh man, I'd almost forgotten that there are people who unironically claim that "scientism" is a religion. I've clearly been out of the religious-arguing loop for too long. Laughing

I don't think that most people, regardless of their religiosity or lack thereof, go through life worrying about how to improve their Darwinian fitness. Speaking anecdotally, I've seen no evidence in the online atheist circles I used to move in that social Darwinism was a common motivation for becoming an atheist (and for the record, I think there are plenty of atheists who are unable to articulate sound reasons for their unbelief). But regardless, the idea that Darwinian fitness is something worth trying to control on a societal level - ie, eugenics - has been pretty comprehensively debunked as well. I for one am very glad for the progress that has been made in the fields of disability rights, medical intervention for the severely ill, and equal opportunity for oppressed populations, and the implicit dismissal of all this really rubs me the wrong way. So I disagree with this guy's most basic premises, but you know me and I couldn't resist digging deeper.

A central claim of our friend at The Federalist is that most children of religious people will stay religious, but his evidence for this is pretty shaky. He points to Hispanic Catholics in the US as an example, despite the fact that the Hispanic population is rapidly becoming less Catholic (source). He also links to a Pew piece that claims there is little evidence that religiosity declines with economic development, in part because "in Hindu-majority India, religious affiliation is still nearly universal despite rapid economic and social change". This is a strawman since India's history of substantial economic growth is less than 30 years old and the only industrialized countries that saw major declines in religiosity that fast were Communist dictatorships (many of which have become more religious since the fall of Communism since being forced to give up your religion is a different phenomenon than the observable trend in many Western liberal democracies).
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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by halfwise on Tue Apr 11, 2017 8:58 pm

Maybe I didn't read it close enough, but I saw him as saying simply that atheists are more likely to believe in Darwinism, but ironically Darwinist principles seem to favor the religious who tend not to believe in it. Shrugging

Scientism may not be a religion, but I think the author more accurately meant 'mindset'. You can see that in that hedonism is included in the same list.

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Re: Religous debates and questions [2]

Post by Eldorion on Tue Apr 11, 2017 9:04 pm

The conflation of the belief that Darwinian evolution is how nature works with Social Darwinism (the idea that humans should consider reproductive fitness a moral good) is a classic canard of the anti-science religious right, as well as textbook example of the appeal to nature fallacy.

halfwise wrote:Scientism may not be a religion, but I think the author more accurately meant 'mindset'.  You can see that in that hedonism is included in the same list.

Read up on the religious right, man (or don't, it can be kinda painful); the idea that science is literally a religion like any other is a very common one in certain circles. EDIT: the same accusation is leveled at various philosophical ideas as well, including humanism and (less commonly, but relevant here), hedonism (link).

EDIT 2: I dunno how common the phrase "religious right" is outside of the US so in the interest of clarity I would like to stress that I am not referring to all political conservatives who happen to be religious or to all members of theologically conservative religious denominations. The American religious right has only really existed in its current form since the 1970s. Politico had a good piece about the movement's origins a few years ago that can be read >here<.
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