Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by davidjoneshoward on Mon Jun 29, 2015 4:03 am

Pettytyrant101 wrote:Well IDK if that's fair to say given that there was lots of character development with Frodo, Sam and Smeagol. - Davidjones

Hello again!

I think he meant the truly secondary characters- Legolas, Gimli, Faramir those sort of characters.

If you take Legolas and Gimli  they get no character development at all in RotK and barely any in TT.
For some reason PJ opted to play down the friendship between Gimli and Legolas and play up an invented one between Legolas and Arargorn- so gone is Gimli and Legolas agreeing to travel together when all is over, gone is Legolas hearing the call of the gulls and getting the sea longing to depart ME, gone is them entering Minas Tirith together and discussing the merits and lack of of Men.

I completely agree with you, Gimli had no purpose whatsoever in RotK other than sheer comic relief (his presence ruined Paths of the Dead for me!) I was fine with the comic relief in TTT, it was't as forced (except when he's rolling down a hill or falling off a horse). IDK why but the line "shall I describe it for you, or shall I find you a box" always makes laugh.

However, although it deviates from the source material, Faramir DOES have character development, when he decides to not take the ring to his father, and let Frodo go to Mordor. But hey, maybe Viggo only saw the theatrical cut?

I think Viggo's main problem with the last two films is that they weren't as subtle. They felt the need to explain everything with forced dialogue, rather than expressions or the cinematography. Thats what FOTR movie did best for me. Also, The Battle of Helms Deep felt like a payoff and climax, unlike the battles in RotK. They were cool, but exhausting.

BTW, what WAS the interview where he said this?
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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Mon Jun 29, 2015 11:44 am

Faramir had sort of character development- in that it lasts for as long as they need it too- once he has done his bit as made up temporary villain its like it never happened in the first place. I suspect Viggo was thinking more of Faramir and Eowyn for example, which in the theatrical is reduced to a singe shot of them standing next to each other.

As to the interview- I cant find the original, it was a long time ago now, however he expressed some very similar thoughts more recently in response to the complaints about TH films-

Turns out Mortensen likes “The Fellowship of the Ring” largely because it was shot in one go. “It was very confusing, we were going at such a pace, and they had so many units shooting, it was really insane. But it’s true that the first script was better organized,” he said. “Also, Peter was always a geek in terms of technology but, once he had the means to do it, and the evolution of the technology really took off, he never looked back.”

Mortensen then suggests as the first movie took off, the sequels started to lose touch with the original’s organic quality. “In the first movie, yes, there’s Rivendell, and Mordor, but there’s sort of an organic quality to it, actors acting with each other, and real landscapes; it’s grittier. The second movie already started ballooning, for my taste, and then by the third one, there were a lot of special effects. It was grandiose, and all that, but whatever was subtle, in the first movie, gradually got lost in the second and third. Now with The Hobbit, one and two, it’s like that to the power of 10.”

“Peter, I was sure he would do another intimately scaled film like ‘Heavenly Creatures,’ maybe with this project about New Zealanders in the First World War he wanted to make. But then he did ‘King Kong.’ And then he did ‘The Lovely Bones’ — and I thought that would be his smaller movie. But the problem is, he did it on a $90 million budget. That should have been a $15 million movie," Mortensen said. "The special effects thing, the genie, was out of the bottle, and it has him. And he’s happy, I think…”- The Telegraph

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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by azriel on Mon Jun 29, 2015 12:59 pm

"“Peter, I was sure he would do another intimately scaled film like ‘Heavenly Creatures,’ maybe with this project about New Zealanders in the First World War he wanted to make. But then he did ‘King Kong.’ And then he did ‘The Lovely Bones’ — and I thought that would be his smaller movie. But the problem is, he did it on a $90 million budget. That should have been a $15 million movie," Mortensen said. "The special effects thing, the genie, was out of the bottle, and it has him. And he’s happy, I think…”- The Telegraph

Then aim that in the right direction you dipstick !!! Dont brutalise Arthurian type Saga's with daft arsed FX that isnt called for or needed. It dilutes the story & the film becomes a video game bore !!

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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by Mrs Figg on Mon Jun 29, 2015 1:46 pm

I personally would LOVE to watch all the raw footage. I would pay good money to see it too. I love you  I am most keen to see Faramirs wedding. and more of the Eowyn in the Caves thingie. More of Legolas wandering in the forest, *sigh*. just all of it really. hope against hope that they even did a bit of Bombadil and Goldberry.

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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Mon Jun 29, 2015 2:17 pm

Eowyn in the Caves thingie- Figg

No thanks, from what we heard the orcs break in and its just another fighting action scene.
Id much rather have Aragorn's parley at the gates of Helms Deep warning the orcs of their fate with the coming of dawn, and I'd have kept the sense of wearying endurance using exchanges such as the one between Aragorn, Eomer and Gamling that starts with Arargorn lamenting- "How long will the day tarry?"

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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by malickfan on Mon Jun 29, 2015 6:45 pm

Eldorion wrote:That's a good point.  Ideally I'd love to see what it would look like finished, but I dunno if WB would feel it's worth the cost.  Plus going back and adding to the scenes 10-15 years later is kinda weird.  I think I'd prefer that they just realize whatever they have, and if SFX work was done at the time, awesome.  But otherwise don't Lucas it now.

I wrote in the original post:

Digging around in my old stack of EMPIRE magazines I came across this nugget (EMPIRE Issue 248 February 2010, page 142). Part of an Article/Interview with Jackson about the then non existent Blu Ray Release it's obviously rather out of date and may not be relevant any longer-but interesting none the less:

''And sparking hope in the hearts of those for whom the myriad hours of extras available just aren't enough, Jackson mentions the possibility of even more exhaustive material. "I have a couple of ideas for a new documentary. We shot and uploaded seven million feet of film to the Avid in New Zealand, and when we finished Rings we said to New Line. 'Why don't leave that here, under lock and key with a dust cloth thrown over it, so we can go back in later?' They said, "No send it all back" and wiped the drives, even though we begged them not to. So to do another documentary, they're going to have to re-digitize all that 35-mil footage, which is in LA now, frame by frame. Which they seem very reluctant to do". So there you have it: all that candid behind-the-scenes material and filmed-but- abandoned footage (perhaps including Arwen's appearance at Helm's Deep and Aragorn's early years). hidden somewhere in Burbank waiting to be discovered like the One Ring itself. But don't hold your breath. "That'll probably turn up on what they call 'the big box set'-the Lord Of The Rings films and the two hobbit films," says Jackson."So it's still four or five years away."

It's now been Five Years Suspect bounce bounce bounce

Of course this all rests on the idea that A) The footage (likely to be raw 35 MM dallies in a rather rough state) still exists in a decent condition B) Jackson can find the time (or inclination, he may simply want to move on at this point), and an editing team willing to sift through thousands of hours of footage C) Jackson and/or the studios can come to an agreement with the various peoples involved


I agree with your points Eldo I think the deleted scenes (if released) should be left as they are, deleted scenes are often interesting, but normally deleted for a very good reason, as interested as the hardcore fans may be, it would probably be pretty weird for the SFX team to go back to this stuff 15 years later and finish it, not to mention possibly being a expensive waste of time, I'm not entirely convinced, possible rights issues aside, with the mixed reception of TH trilogy, and the fall in sales of physical media that the studio and/Weta would find it practical to devote months and millions to this project when a relatively small amount of people would be inclined to shell out for a boxset.

I hope I'm proven wrong though!

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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by Eldorion on Tue Jun 30, 2015 1:46 am

I wonder when the most recent time that PJ has talked about an Ultimate Edition/new version of LOTR/combined six film box set was. We don't really know anything about the BOFA-EE release yet but there will presumably be a three film Hobbit EE box set. I wouldn't be surprised if they hold off on releasing a six film collection (with or without new bonus features) for another year at least though.
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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by Bluebottle on Tue Jun 30, 2015 10:31 am

Things have certainly quietened down after the reception of the Hobbit movies. Which is kinda sad. I don't know if that might have put a dampener on any future plans? Shrugging

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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by Mrs Figg on Tue Jun 30, 2015 1:54 pm

I think people still love LOTR.

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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by Eldorion on Tue Jun 30, 2015 4:04 pm

I agree with Mrs Figg, but I do wonder if the studio might not see things that way. Hopefully The Hobbit trilogy's grosses (nearly a billion each) will still be enough to convince them to invest in quality future home video relaeses, even if those grosses weren't at the same level as what some people were expecting after the success of LOTR.
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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by Mrs Figg on Tue Jun 30, 2015 8:30 pm

I have a feeling they will milk it dry while its still fresh.

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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by Forest Shepherd on Wed Jul 01, 2015 10:30 pm

Heck, if they just put it all up on Youtube I'd be happy. Smile

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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by Mrs Figg on Thu Jul 02, 2015 12:06 am

me too. Very Happy

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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by David H on Thu Jul 02, 2015 12:08 am

not me Mad

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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by Forest Shepherd on Thu Jul 02, 2015 12:52 am

Laughing

Perhaps a mail-in-video request option?

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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by Mrs Figg on Thu Jul 02, 2015 2:12 pm

maybe a karaoke version

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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by azriel on Thu Jul 02, 2015 5:29 pm

Sign language version ? Could it be worse ?

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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by Forest Shepherd on Fri Jul 03, 2015 6:50 am

Rotoscoped version??

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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by malickfan on Mon Jul 06, 2015 8:20 pm

Eldorion wrote:I wonder when the most recent time that PJ has talked about an Ultimate Edition/new version of LOTR/combined six film box set was.

Didn't he show a few snippets at the 2014(?) Comic Con, I vaguely recall reading about this on TORn scratch

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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by Eldorion on Tue Jul 07, 2015 3:50 pm

I didn't recall that, but did a bit of googling and apparently he did show some scenes at SDCC last year. Dunno if any specifics got online though.

https://atolkienistperspective.wordpress.com/2014/08/05/the-middle-earth-box-set-ultimate-edition-speculations/
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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by malickfan on Sun Dec 13, 2015 5:33 pm

This new interview with Michael Pellerin (director/producer of the EE appendices special features for both trilogies) teases once more deleted scenes and new special features (and addresses complaints about TH films):

http://geekleagueofamerica.com/2015/12/09/21324/


Over the course of the production, we collected all sorts of material in 3D to tell a proper story about high frame rate, about 3D, and do that whole side. That was originally going to be part of the 3D release but by the time the Hobbit films came out, 3D home video wasn’t doing as well as they had hoped they would. So consequently, they weren’t paying a lot of money to support extra features for 3D. So that stuff never saw the light of day. I have all this 3D stuff and not just behind the scenes shot in 3D, but actually behind the scenes with the 3D guys demonstrating 3D IN 3D! You know what I mean? It’s there, it’s in the treasure box with all the other goodies. Maybe someday, if there’s enough interest, certainly the raw materials are there to do something with it.

From the earliest days, all the material was vetted by Peter and decided to be used now or saved for later and we saved A LOT of cool stuff for later. It was conscious. It was like, you know, “Years from now, they aren’t going to believe this!” We’re got this treasure chest of (about) 20 hours of content and some of the stuff … is some of the coolest stuff we have. I’d like that to have that see the light of day. Like I said, there is no chronicles of the Lord of the Rings, that chronological story that we got to do with The Hobbit, that Costa didn’t get to do with his documentaries, and I didn’t get to do with the Lord of the Rings appendices. That has yet to be done and Peter has always threatened to direct that himself, to actually do that himself Even recently, he’s said that. So suddenly a Peter Jackson directed chronological series on the Lord of the Rings using the dailies and using the call sheets and using all the behind the scenes footage, of which there is so much that never even saw the light of day, as the backbone, …that would be mind-blowing and as well, of course all the deleted scenes. Because as you know, on the Lord of the Rings (home video releases), there was no deleted scenes. On The Hobbit, we got away with including deleted scenes material in the context of the Chronicles… and there was a lot of stuff out of Rings.

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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Sun Dec 13, 2015 5:43 pm

God no make it stop- no more!!!!!!! Evil or Very Mad

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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by Mrs Figg on Sun Dec 13, 2015 5:55 pm

So suddenly a Peter Jackson directed chronological series on the Lord of the Rings using the dailies and using the call sheets and using all the behind the scenes footage, of which there is so much that never even saw the light of day, as the backbone, …that would be mind-blowing and as well, of course all the deleted scenes. Because as you know, on the Lord of the Rings (home video releases), there was no deleted scenes.

Razz cheers wowzer! maybe one day we will get to see this amazing stuff! cant wait, that will be awesome.

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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by azriel on Sun Dec 13, 2015 6:31 pm

Id like to see that as well ! Be interesting. What would I have preferred to see in the film that actually was left out ??

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Re: Unreleased deleted scenes from the trilogy etc

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Sun Dec 13, 2015 7:17 pm

What would I have preferred to see in the film that actually was left out ??- Azriel

A book written by Tolkien? Shrugging

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