FREEDOM!!!! [4]

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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by Bluebottle on Sun Nov 19, 2017 1:03 am


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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by malickfan on Fri Nov 24, 2017 7:07 pm

I just found out a friend of mine, who I've known for 8 years was born in Scotland and spent his first four years there (later moving to England), not sure why I'm so surprised as his mother and grandparents are Scottish, either I don't know him as well as I thought or I'm an blissful idiot...

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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by Bluebottle on Fri Nov 24, 2017 11:03 pm

Is your friend Gordon Ramsay? Sofa

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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by Bluebottle on Sun Nov 26, 2017 5:06 pm

"Yesterday we learned that, on occasion of the inter-parliamentary meeting between the EU and the People’s Republic of China held in Brussels last Friday, the Chinese delegation formally asked to broach the subject of Catalonia. The item was added to the official agenda and the Chinese representatives made the most of it, not for Catalonia’s sake but for theirs.

Specifically, the Chinese MPs asked whether the EU supported Mariano Rajoy’s decisions on Catalonia. When the confirmation came that it does indeed, they asked if the two basic rules implied by the intervention would also apply to the EU’s relationship with China from now on. In other words, they asked whether in future the EU would regard Tibet and Taiwan as China’s internal affairs and, therefore, it would refrain from criticising any of Beijing’s actions there. They also enquired if the same measures adopted by Madrid, which violate human rights in Catalonia, would no longer be slammed if they were adopted by Beijing. We are talking about the violation of private correspondence, shutting down web pages and jailing political leaders."
https://www.vilaweb.cat/noticies/the-eu-is-beginning-to-grasp-the-high-price-it-is-paying-for-the-repression-in-catalonia/

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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by halfwise on Sun Nov 26, 2017 5:23 pm

SWACK!

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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by David H on Sun Nov 26, 2017 6:05 pm

Well played! Thumbs Up

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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Mon Nov 27, 2017 12:05 am

Thoughts, Petty?- Blue


{{Its hard to judge going on him as he has had a low profile up to now. It does however finally bring the Scottish party in line with the Corbyn party in Westminster.

But the real proof will be in how, if anything, changes. Scottish Labour funding from donations has collapsed, they run on showstring much lower than the SNP or Tories in Scotland, or probably even the lib-dems. Its that bad. Be interesting to see what Corbyn does about that if anything.
Previous Scottish leaders complained of London Labour treating the Scottish party as a 'branch office' and there is no signs thats changed- so thats an area to watch now Scottish Labour no longer have a leader hostile to Corbyn.
Also policy merging- more in the other direction this time- Scottish Labour, even under Dugdale who was a centralist and opposed Corbyn and the Momentum side of the party, already voted at Conference for example to not renew the UK nuclear arsenal- something the English party could not do for political English reasons- but the left of the party and Corbyn himself are in line with the Scottish party in their thinking- so will be interesting to see if some of the Scottish positions effect the Westminster ones.
The view in England in general towards nukes hasn't changed- they are happy to have them so long as they arent actually kept in their country near any of their people- but it may become harder for Labour leadership to ignore calls against having nukes when the Scottish voice begins to be added more strongly to the rest of Corbyns left wing followers.

In terms of policy hard to see where Labour place themselves in Scotland- the Tories have stitched up the no independence UK vote, and they scraped a bit of the pro-independence anti-Eu vote, the SNP, lib-dems and greens combined have effectively got the left side of politics pretty well covered.
Its likely they will try to steal some votes from the Tories, placing themselves as a socialist Unionist party- expect speeches about how a factory worker in Govan is the same as one in Tyneside and lots of use of the word solidarity! Working Together and all that stuff for the common good of the working man and woman.
And they will try to regain votes from the SNP, particularly in their old strongholds in Glasgow, probably by going back to trying to portray them as 'tartan Tories' who are not really socialist but right of centre- what the SNP do withe new tax bands will of course either provide fuel for this or completely undercut it before it can get off the ground- thats an are to watch for.
But mainly they will probably fail to find a gap to hold ground on and fall back on what they have been doing for years now- hissing and booing from the sidelines shouting "SNP BAD!" which hasn't exactly worked for them so far- but its about the only political poisitin left open to them. }}}

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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by Bluebottle on Tue Nov 28, 2017 2:30 pm

Interesting! Thanks, Petty

I guess the problem for Labour is the basic conceit. Federalism is not feasible, so you become the same as the Conservatives on independence, only they tell you the truth of their position. As long as Labour is national and not Scottish, it will suffer the same malaise I'm afraid. Always caring more for UK than Scottish matters, always following the national line in case of conflict. Not a real alternative for Scotland. And by the half stance on independence they fall between two chairs. One the one hand, for independence that is positive, because it shows that Scottish politics are growing apart form national politics. But without the support of the traditional centre-left, a prospect like independence is always going to have a much harder road to walk.

It is very much the same in Catalonia I'm afraid. The nonsense of federalism hiding the hard unionist reality, and full complicity in the fight against independence.

I think somewhat the independence side is wrong to, because they ask the wrong question: Should we be independent? When the correct question is what is our best political organization in the future? Then you ask, the status quo? What are the merits of that? Federalism? What are the merits of that? What is the feasibility of that? Independence? What are the merits of that?

Then you get clarity of choice, and show the middle road as what it is in the yes or no to independence question. Impossible to bring forward, and ultimately a vote for (something like) the status quo.

The important thing is to put clear and varied choices democratically in the hands of the people, and an independence referendum isn't necessarily the best means for that. But it is the only means you have with a state uninterested in cooperating and finding solutions,which was the case both in Scotland and Catalonia. The slight of hand of offering the choice of all to avoid giving something real in Scotland, and in Spain the brutal denial of even a choice.

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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by Bluebottle on Tue Nov 28, 2017 5:54 pm


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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by Bluebottle on Tue Nov 28, 2017 6:39 pm


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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by malickfan on Tue Nov 28, 2017 7:53 pm

Bluebottle wrote:Is your friend Gordon Ramsay? Sofa

Depends, does Gordon Ramsay have a secret double life as a 25 year old college IT worker obsessed with The Walking Dead and Daisy Ridley?

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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by halfwise on Tue Nov 28, 2017 9:37 pm

Who doesn't have an obsession with The Walking Dead and Daisy Ridley? Suspect

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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by malickfan on Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:04 pm

halfwise wrote:Who doesn't have an obsession with The Walking Dead and Daisy Ridley? Suspect

Well I've never watched the Walking Dead but Daisy Ridley... cyclops :brows: I love you Embarassed


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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by bungobaggins on Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:01 pm

halfwise wrote:Who doesn't have an obsession with The Walking Dead and Daisy Ridley? Suspect

I don't really care for either.

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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by chris63 on Wed Nov 29, 2017 4:07 am

A Scotsman phones a dentist to enquire about the cost of a tooth extraction.

“85 pounds for an extraction, sir” the dentist replied.

“85 quid! Huv ye no’got anythin’ cheaper?”

“That’s the normal charge,” said the dentist.

“Whit aboot if ye didnae use any anaesthetic?”

“That’s unusual, sir, but I could do it and would knock 15 pounds off.”

“Whit aboot if ye used one of your dentist trainees and still without any anaesthetic?”

“I can’t guarantee their professionalism and it’ll be painful. But the price could drop by 20 pounds.”

“How aboot if ye make it a trainin’ session, ave yer student do the extraction with the other students watchin’ and learnin’?”

“It’ll be good for the students”, mulled the dentist. “I’ll charge you 5 pounds but it will be traumatic.”

“Och, now yer talkin’ laddie! It’s a deal,” said the Scotsman. “Can ye confirm an appointment for the wife next Tuesday then.”

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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Thu Nov 30, 2017 12:22 pm

{{{ Laughing }}}

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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by malickfan on Thu Nov 30, 2017 5:57 pm

You got any snow up there today Petty? seeing lots of photos online. Freezing but dry as a bone down here, probably been 6 or 7 years since we had major snow, almost nostaglic for the stuff...

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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by Bluebottle on Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:53 am

For anyone wondering just how bad things have gotten in Spain, this is a legal analysis of the Supreme Court resolution that today left two catalan ministers and two civil society leaders in jail on the eve of a ("free and fair") election campaign.

"Those who say that there are no political prisoners, I would ask them to read the resolution of December 4th on Oriol Junqueras, Joaquim Forn and the two Jordis, that explains that the defendants are at risk of criminal reiteration because they are independentists: [Page 15] "On the one hand, all those investigated in the procedure share - and recognize that they still maintain - the same aspiration that promoted the behavior that is being investigated, that is, the will that the territory of the Autonomous Community in which they reside constitute the base territory of a new republic." This paragraph is quite clairvoyant: the behavior that is investigated is a political project, an idea, which contravenes a basic principle of the criminal law of any minimal democracy gathered in the aphorism cogitationes poenam nemo patitur, nobody can be punished for their thinking. The thoughts do not delineate, it is the facts that generate responsibility.

Those who say there are no political prisoners, I would ask them to continue reading the resolution explaining that to assess whether there is a risk of criminal reiteration or not, to justify the interim prison, it is based on the assumption that "the investigated abjure that behavior for the future". This is not compatible with Article 16 EC, which protects freedom of belief and ideology, and which prohibits the public authorities from questioning citizens in this manner. That the highest judicial authority in Spain uses as an argument of imprisonment not only the ideas or beliefs of the defendant, but also permits that an act such as abjuration may be produced in a statement, an action linked above all to faith and convictions and that in the language itself has been linked to the Inquisition under the expression 'abjure of heresy' (Alcover-Moll). Abjuration and administration of democratic justice are antagonistic concepts.

Those who say that there are no political prisoners, I would ask them to reflect on a text that reminds the accused now released as a result of the act of abjuration of their convictions that "if the result of the 21-D election ends facilitating the investigators a decision-making capacity similar to that of their claims, their precautionary measures could be modified." Therefore, it has no problem in interfering with the political projects of a hypothetical government that emerges from the open electoral process, violating the roles of independence and separation of powers that correspond to the judiciary. A vision that also attacks the right of political participation of the citizens as it conditions the freedom of the political projects that can be chosen and limits the capacity of the elected.

Those who say that there are no political prisoners, I would ask them to think about the statement made by Judge Llarena when he analyzes the pro-independence movements , as a whole, as an amalgam, in an exercise of general cause and says that "the infiltration of numerous violent and aggressive behaviors, which reflected the violent germ that risked to expand." In a case against the Catalan government and the leaders of the ANC and AN it is hard to know what he is talking about, but the judge violates an essential principle of criminal law that is to act always only for past events, never for future events. There is no preventive criminal law in a state that is based on the rule of law.
Those who say there are no political prisoners, I would ask them to react to a resolution that criticizes the fact that the determination of the government has counted on civil society. The participation of people as criminal element. Thus, the interlocutor points out as an element of the criminal plan that "specifies that this determination must be shared by the citizens that support them. (...) the citizens must be actively involved". And there is nothing more typical of a democratic plan and in accordance with the same constitution as public powers that facilitate the participation of citizens in political, economic, cultural and social life (art. 9 CE). It should not be something extraordinary in our institutional system, much less criminal.

Those who say there are no political prisoners, I would ask them to re-read this judicial resolution in relation to the one that the same judge dictated on November 9 for the presidency of the Catalan parliament that verifies the basic thesis that the indissoluble unity of the Spanish nation should be protected above all and that you instrumentalize the criminal procedure for this purpose to the extent necessary, by all means. When judicial decisions of this importance departs from, as Llarena himself does, a distinct reading of the constitution and collective rights, stating that there is no possibility of negotiating independence or of articulating a legal path to the construction of the Catalan Republic, it allows the court to infer directly that any contribution to the independentist plan is directly criminal."
https://www.vilaweb.cat/noticies/a-la-foguera-opinio-contundent-benet-salellas/

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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by Bluebottle on Thu Dec 14, 2017 3:14 pm

Mònica Terribas has responded in her editorial today on 'El Mati de Catalunya Ràdio' to the decision of the Spanish Electoral Board to open a sanctioning proceeding against the station. The board paid attention to a denunciation of the PP and considered that the program had violated the principles of political neutrality. Textually, the resolution of the board said that the publishers of Terribas on November 28 and 30 had a partisan tone and voter openly favorable to those political formations that argue that there is an unfair repression on the legitimate government of Catalonia.*

Terribas' response has been the reading of a fragment of Cyrano de Bergerac , by Edmond Rostand.

«And what should I do?
Find a rich protector, serve it with discipline,
And like a dark ivy surrounding an oak tree
and uses it as a strut while licking the bark,
to climb cunning instead of lifting me to the force?
No thankyou. Dedicate, like any author,
verses to financiers? Become cute
with the vile hope of getting caught up in a minister
the sketch of a smile that is not sinister?
No thankyou. Every day I swallow my toads
for breakfast? Bring your knees full of blue;
And, with so many footsteps, also the abs?
Give continuous tests of dorsal skills? ...
No thankyou. Always want the fish to finish in the cove,
while at all times I swim and keep the clothes?
No thankyou!"
https://www.vilaweb.cat/noticies/la-resposta-de-monica-terribas-a-la-junta-electoral-i-el-pp-cada-dia-empassar-me-gripaus-per-esmorzar-no-gracies/

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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by Bluebottle on Thu Dec 14, 2017 3:19 pm

*
Vice-president Junqueras, the minister Forn and Jordi Sànchez and Jordi Cuixart are in prison. Junqueras heads the list of ERC and Forn i Sànchez are part of the list of Together for Catalonia. Those who are outside, are all aware that they say can cause serious problem for them.

And even more: the counselors who have been released after being imprisoned have been warned that they can not speak according to how things are, as the counselor Rull explained in the interview today. He warned that they can not even say what these things are that they cannot speak of, though everyone can easily imagine it.
https://www.vilaweb.cat/noticies/la-falsa-roda-del-hamster-editorial-vicent-partal/

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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by David H on Thu Dec 14, 2017 5:26 pm

Bluebottle wrote:
Terribas' response has been the reading of a fragment of Cyrano de Bergerac , by Edmond Rostand.

«And what should I do?
Find a rich protector, serve it with discipline,
And like a dark ivy surrounding an oak tree
and uses it as a strut while licking the bark,
to climb cunning instead of lifting me to the force?
No thankyou. Dedicate, like any author,
verses to financiers? Become cute
with the vile hope of getting caught up in a minister
the sketch of a smile that is not sinister?
No thankyou. Every day I swallow my toads
for breakfast? Bring your knees full of blue;
And, with so many footsteps, also the abs?
Give continuous tests of dorsal skills? ...
No thankyou. Always want the fish to finish in the cove,
while at all times I swim and keep the clothes?
No thankyou!"

https://www.vilaweb.cat/noticies/la-resposta-de-monica-terribas-a-la-junta-electoral-i-el-pp-cada-dia-empassar-me-gripaus-per-esmorzar-no-gracies/[/quote]

That's a great speech! It deserves to be spoken often.Nod
I took a quick look for a youtube clip but I don't have the bandwidth Mad
so here's at least a more poetic translation:
And what would you have me do?
Seek for the patronage of some great man,
And like a creeping vine on a tall tree
Crawl upward, where I cannot stand alone?
No thank you! Dedicate, as others do,
Poems to pawnbrokers? Be a buffoon
In the vile hope of teasing out a smile
On some cold face? No thank you! Eat a toad
For breakfast every morning? Make my knees
callous, and cultivate a supple spine,-
Wear out my belly grovelling in the dust?
No thank you! Scratch the back of any swine
That roots up gold for me? Tickle the horns
of Mammon with my left hand, while my right
Too proud to know his partner's business
Takes in the fee? No thank you! Use the fire
God gave me to burn incense all day long
Under the nose of wood and stone? No thank you!
Shall I go leaping into ladies laps
And licking fingers?-or-to change form-
Navigating with madrigals for oars,
My sails full of the sighs of dowagers?
No thank you! Publish verses at my own
Expense? No thank you! Be the patron saint
Of a small group of leterary souls
Who dine together every Tuesday? No
I thank you! Shall I labor night and day
To build a reputation on one song,
And never write another? Shall I find
True genius only among Geniuses,
Palpitate over little paragraphs,
And struggle to insinuate my name
In the columns of the Mercury?
No thank you! Calculate, scheme, be afraid,
Love more to make a visit than a poem,
Seek introductions, favors, influences?-
No thank you! No, I thank you! And again
I thank you!- But...

To sing, to laugh, to dream,
To walk in my own way and be alone,
Free, with an eye to see things as they are,
A voice that means manhood- to cock my hat
Where I choose- At a word, a Yes, a No,
To fight- or write. To travel any road
Under the sun, under the stars, nor doubt
If fame or fortune lie beyond the bourne-
ever to make a line I have not heard
In my own heart; yet, with all modesty
To say: "My soul, be satisfied with flowers,
With fruit, with weeds even; but gather them
In the one garden you may call your own."
So, when I win some triumph, by some chance,
Render no share to Caesar- in a word,
I am to proud to be a parasite,
And if my nature wants the germ that grows
Towering to heaven like the mountain pine,
Or like the oak, sheltering multitudes-
I stand, not high it may be- But alone!

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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by Bluebottle on Thu Dec 14, 2017 6:09 pm

Thanks, that is rather special Nod And descriptive of the situation. This woman made an editorial, and editorial, on public radio and now the central electoral commission, consisting of members of the national parties (unionists) and judges appointed by what in Spain is a highly politicial judicial commission. And it is just the tip of the iceberg:

"Spain has low rule of law. Some of the significant evidence for this is as follows. Spain’s biggest ever corruption scandals are called Gürtel and Bárcenas. They involve allegations involving criminal expropriation of large sums of money in favour of the Partido Popular, Spain’s governing party in Madrid; and its Prime Minister, Mariano Rajoy. The investigating Judge, Baltasar Garzón, was suspended not just once but twice on absurd pretexts. Now he is off the case and it has stalled.

One of the accusations against Garzón was that he had investigated Franco-era war crimes against Partido Popular politicians with too much vigour. European institutions have expressed concerns about the independence of the Spanish judiciary and its overly intimate associations with the Partido Popular. The Partido Popular is a successor of a political party associated with one or more Ministers of Franco’s fascist regime in Spain between 1939 and 1975.

A national paramilitary police unit, the Guardia Civil, was engaged by the Spanish central government (controlled by the Partido Popular) to stop the 1 October 2017 Catalan independence referendum. This took place even though, although legally controversial, the conduct of that election did not amount to any crime.

If it was unlawful to hold the referendum (and that remains an issue of legal controversy), then this was purely a civil wrong and not a criminal matter. Spain’s Criminal Code does not criminalise the holding of referenda or ballots. Therefore no branch of the Police was properly involved in trying to stop it.

The Guardia Civil were deployed to Catalonia without legal authority. They confiscated ballot boxes. They attacked people trying to vote, reportedly including firing baton rounds at unarmed voters. They used violence to close polling stations. Whatever the legality of the referendum, the Guardia Civil had no plausible legal authority to do these things.

Subsequently the Spanish courts imprisoned Catalan politicians and activists involved in the independence movement. They did this without those people being accused of any crime. Some Catalan politicians were released only upon payment of bail amounts wholly disproportionate to their incomes or assets. No obvious grounds for detention of peaceful politicians were made out. These politicians were not fugitives; they attended Court voluntarily. Four remain in prison, even though some of their names will appear on ballot papers in the forthcoming elections on 21 December 2017.

Some Catalan politicians fled to Brussels, fearing imminent unjustified detention. The Spanish government issued European Arrest Warrants against them, but then withdrew them. They did this when they realised that extradition procedures before the Belgian courts were bound to fail. The Madrid judiciary had opened investigations against peaceful politicians for medieval crimes, such as sedition and rebellion. No modern democracy respects crimes like this in the absence of established violent intent which was missing.

By obscure constitutional dictate, Madrid dismissed the entire Catalan regional government and its parliament, and imposed rule by decree. The abolished institutions had been democratically elected. Nothing like this has been seen in a modern democracy since the 1975 Australian Constitutional Crisis. That led to the resignation in disgrace of the Australian Governor-General, after he had dismissed the democratically elected Australian Prime Minister.

The government in Madrid has banned public bodies in Catalonia from displaying the colour yellow. That is because yellow is alleged to be associated with nationalism. Madrid has made orders to remove cultural objects from a Catalan museum. Madrid has announced that there will be no election observers for the 21 December 2017 elections, because the law forbids them. But there is no Spanish legal rule that says this. The law is flexible on the point. The 2015 Spanish elections to the Cortes Generales were overseen by OSCE. Spain routinely sends election observers to other parts of the world."
http://www.transconflict.com/2017/12/ballot-fraud-catalan-elections-happen-132/

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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by Bluebottle on Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:48 am

"In his masterpiece 1984, George Orwell describes the workings of a dystopian state that tries to control how its citizens think. One of the dictatorship’s favourite tools is what is known as Newspeak, which consists of calling things the exact opposite of what they really are. For example, the state speaks of the "Ministry of Truth" to refer to the ministry that censors and manipulates information, of the "Ministry of Peace" to speak of the war department, the "Ministry of Love" to allude to those engaged in torture and the "Ministry of Abundance" to refer to those who are charged with managing shortages.

Orwell would find the use of Newspeak in Spain utterly fascinating. With more than 900 individuals charged with corruption and people "accidentally" dying days before having to give evidence in court, Spain’s Partido Popular is undoubtedly the most corrupt political party in Europe. Nevertheless, on a daily basis day we see its leaders deliver sermons about the need for "everyone to comply with the law".

The unionists label the pro-independence parties supremacists, fascists and Nazis, even though it is at unionist demonstrations that the swastikas inevitably appear and where Nazi or Francoist salutes can be observed. And it is their leaders (such as MEP Javier Nart) who openly speak of sterilizing (that’s right, sterilizing!) women with a high probability of giving birth to children with disabilities. That is about as Nazi as one can get.

They accuse pro-independence activists of violence, while they imprison their leaders without trial for crimes of "rebellion" and "sedition", two concepts that require acts of violence which no one has ever witnessed. What's more, it is their police who beat elderly ladies outside polling stations, they are the ones who start the campaign with a rallying cry which is an incitement to violence, "Let ‘em have it!", and they are the ones whose demonstrations always end in a punch up.

They say that Catalonia is plagued by social problems because our Parliament wastes time arguing about independence instead of passing laws that "truly interest the people". But the truth is that a total of 26 laws of a social nature have been suspended or overturned by the Constitutional Court at the request of the Spanish government."

https://www.ara.cat/en/The-separatists-are-to-blame_0_1924607602.html

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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:30 pm

{{You may remember when talking about Scottish Labours new leader I mentioned that how Labour could position themselves was partly dependent on what the SNP does with its tax plan. Well the SNP have released there tax plan, and it rather neatly show the right wing press bias in this country.
Here are some of todays headlines in Scottish (by which I mean written and produced in England and sold in Scotland as Scottish) newspapers-

'SNP's Festive Smash 'n' Grab- tax hikes for 1.6 million Scots'- Scottish Daily Express

'Nightmare Before Christmas- SNP hits 3/4 million Scots with tax hike- middle class hammered'- Scottish Daily Mail

'One million Scots to pay more income tax than rest of UK'- The Scotsman

'A Milllion Scots to pay More Tax'- Daily Telegraph

'Warning on economy as SNP unveils new tax plan'- The Times

So what is this seemingly heinous raid on Scottish workers. UM, well lets see-

The SNP have created a new 5 band tax system.

The following is based on the BBC News analysis-


Well they introduced a new lower rate, so the lowest paid workers will only pay 19 pence in the pound- this covers wages up to £13,850 per year.

The lower end of the middle class, earning between £13,851 and 24,000 will pay an extar 1p in the pound, at a 20p rate.

The upper end of the middle class, those earning between £44,274 and 150,000 will pay a 41p rate and the rich, those earning above 150,000 will pay 46p.

The BBC sum it up as-

'This isn't just as simple as lower earners getting a tax cut, while the better off pay more.
Because the higher-rate threshold is rising by the rate of inflation, people earning £50,000 in Scotland will actually be £85 better off in 2018-19 than they were the previous year - the rising threshold means less of their income is being taxed at the higher rate. Overall, 70% of Scottish taxpayers will pay less than they do at present, while 55% will pay less than they would if they lived elsewhere in the UK. That does, of course, mean 30% will pay more than they did last year - and 45% will pay more than they would if they lived south of the border.'

So basically a majority (mainly those at the lower end of the economic scale but in full time employment) are better off, the rich pay more but because of rising thresholds are actually still paying less than previously in real terms, and the public sector get the 1% pay cap removed and replaced by a 3% pay rise for those under £30,000, 2% for those over £30,000 and those earning over £80,000 will have increases capped at £1,600, and public services and the NHS get a much needed cash injection.

Lucky our printed press got that all across so well! Mad }}}

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Re: FREEDOM!!!! [4]

Post by halfwise on Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:41 pm

If Scotland is generally so liberal how does it have a conservative press?

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