All New Who

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Re: All New Who

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Mon May 28, 2018 5:59 pm

{{Ive had to put ice on my crabbit meter Mad }}

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Re: All New Who

Post by halfwise on Mon May 28, 2018 8:16 pm

Well, cats will find their way into any dry, warm spot. It's just what they do. I don't see how this is any different from the Doctor wearing a woollen scarf.

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Re: All New Who

Post by Amarië on Mon May 28, 2018 9:04 pm

I think there might be some complaints if that is what the cat will be used for. Laughing

Data and Spot were a cute match though, I guess it depends on how they do it.

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Re: All New Who

Post by azriel on Mon May 28, 2018 9:36 pm



Was this you, as a child Petty ?

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Re: All New Who

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Mon May 28, 2018 11:26 pm

{{{  Laughing 'Fraid not Azriel- and sadly I suspect that child is not even really Scottish- as no scot would wear a kilt the colour of vegetables!! No }}}

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Re: All New Who

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Mon May 28, 2018 11:52 pm

{{{ Taking broader Who into account the Doctors had talking penguins and flying dinos in the TARDIS so a cat's pretty mild- just seems odd especially when you've already got four main characters to split screen time between, plus plot, villains ect to give time over to a cat, any time.

on a more positive note, thought this was very well made-}}}


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Re: All New Who

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Tue May 29, 2018 9:16 pm

{{Rumours and possible spoilers-

Spoiler:


The cat is called Percy. And in the opening episode and possibly for the finale we have a returning favourite- its rumoured that Captain Jack is returning along with Gwen Cooper
}}

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Re: All New Who

Post by Mrs Figg on Tue May 29, 2018 11:57 pm

did someone mention cats? mine has given me fleas and hides in my car engine. Mad

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Re: All New Who

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Wed May 30, 2018 12:32 am

{{Well I hope the Doctors cat doesn't hide in the TARDIS engines- not sure what happens when you add a cat to a sun perpetually held in the moment of collapsing into a black hole but it probably involves spaghetti! No  }}}

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Re: All New Who

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Thu May 31, 2018 8:06 pm

{{This is worth a watch- talking about time travel in stories and in this bit Who }}


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Re: All New Who

Post by azriel on Thu Jun 14, 2018 12:40 pm


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Re: All New Who

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Fri Jun 15, 2018 4:27 pm

{{Allegedly the end of an era- the last Jago and Litefoot BF story ever!! For those who dont know this pair they appeared in the 4th Doctor story The Talons of Weng-Chiang which was set in Victorian London- Jago and Litefoot were if you like the original Paternoster Gang, and they have been reappearing in their own line of BF stories for years as a Who spin off series. }}






{{And heres part 1 of Talons- not very pc by todays standards though it never bothered me the Chinese guy was a white guy in make-up as it was always referencing older stuff like Fu Manchu as much as it does gothic horror and Hammer House of Horror films-oh and you need to change the playback speed, three little lines top right of the vid screen, click that set the speed to 0.75}}


https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x62guh5


{{ps- question to Admin- why cant I put up dailymotion vids? When I try it tells me its an invalid dailymotion link! }}}

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Re: All New Who

Post by malickfan on Fri Jun 15, 2018 10:18 pm

Pettytyrant101 wrote:{{Allegedly the end of an era- the last Jago and Litefoot BF story ever!! For those who dont know this pair they appeared in the 4th Doctor story The Talons of Weng-Chiang which was set in Victorian London- Jago and Litefoot were if you like the original Paternoster Gang, and they have been reappearing in their own line of BF stories for years as a Who spin off series. }}






{{And heres part 1 of Talons- not very pc by todays standards though it never bothered me the Chinese guy was a white guy in make-up as it was always referencing older stuff like Fu Manchu as much as it does gothic horror and Hammer House of Horror films-oh and you need to change the playback speed, three little lines top right of the vid screen, click that set the speed to 0.75}}


https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x62guh5


{{ps- question to Admin- why cant I put up dailymotion vids? When I try it tells me its an invalid dailymotion link! }}}


Talons is a fantastic serial, and I've listened to three or four of the Jago and Lightfoot audios, great series, nice cozy listening, anchored by the chemistry of the two leads, such a shame it's ended after the sad passing of Trevor Baxter, but judging by the reviews it was a fitting way to bow out, my BF collection expands ever more (it did this very day in fact, damn you tempting warehouse clearance sales!) and I'm very much planning on eventually getting properly into J+L if my budget and spare time ever allows. Apparently the scripts for series 14 were finished and ready to record before Baxter's passing, BF have hinted they would like to bring them to the public in some form eventually, perhaps as audiobooks or expanded into novels if the license ever allows?

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Re: All New Who

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Fri Jun 15, 2018 10:41 pm

{{Damn I did not know that was the reaosn- missed that sad news somehow. I did know there was another series being written which is why I said 'allegedly' thinking it was a tricksy bit of marketing- now I wish it was.
I've only listened to a couple of their BF and had much the same experience as yourself Malick, its easy to see how they have retained enough of a following to have survived from the 1970's till today. Maybe they will now get a spin off comic or something  with the series written but sadly now never to be performed. }}}

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Re: All New Who

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Tue Jun 19, 2018 5:22 pm

{{{Chibnall, Whittaker and the rest of the new cast will all be on a panel at San Deigo Comic-Con- so we finally might get some actual information about what they are doing, how pc is all sounds, and hopefully actually find out who the bloody writers are! And I assume at least a teaser trailer (rumour had it the teaser would be during Englands first world cup match and the full trailer at Comic-Con, but there was no teaser during the game so who knows now) }}}

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Re: All New Who

Post by malickfan on Tue Jun 19, 2018 8:07 pm

Pettytyrant101 wrote:{{Damn I did not know that was the reaosn- missed that sad news somehow. I did know there was another series being written which is why I said 'allegedly' thinking it was a tricksy bit of marketing- now I wish it was.
I've only listened to a couple of their BF and had much the same experience as yourself Malick, its easy to see how they have retained enough of a following to have survived from the 1970's till today. Maybe they will now get a spin off comic or something  with the series written but sadly now never to be performed. }}}

I read somewhere that Baxter had been seriously ill for quite some time, so this news wasn't unexpected given his health and age, but sad nonetheless.

Looking at the wiki it seems Colin Baker appeared as the 6th Doctor in at least eight stories with the duo, something I didn't know (though I've listened to the two 'Voyage' stories he did with them, good fun)

In other, more surprising Big Finish news, they are doing Class audios! Shocked very surprised they would touch that corner of the whoniverse so soon, it wasn't very popular was it? and eight episodes doesn't leave much room or backstory to elaborate on, interesting they are bringing back Ace and the Daleks though to tie it more into the main who canon, as someone who collects BF mainly on CD, the news of a rather limited print run is interesting, I wonder if this signifies a change in the other ranges? could they end up going entirely download only?

https://www.bigfinish.com/news/v/class-returns

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Re: All New Who

Post by malickfan on Tue Jun 19, 2018 8:19 pm

Pettytyrant101 wrote:{{{Chibnall, Whittaker and the rest of the new cast will all be on a panel at San Deigo Comic-Con- so we finally might get some actual information about what they are doing, how pc is all sounds, and hopefully actually find out who the bloody writers are! And I assume at least a teaser trailer (rumour had it the teaser would be during Englands first world cup match and the full trailer at Comic-Con, but there was no teaser during the game so who knows now) }}}

I am a tad surprised just how secretive Chibnall is being about S10, I get he wants to make a fresh start and creative reboot with a big impact, but keeping so much info back till the episodes actually air may kill more interest than it creates...I think some of the details we've learned (historical episodes, King James appearing in one, possible apperance from Sontarans) have only been confirmed because cast members let slip when they werent supposed to..

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I think what comes out of a pig's rear end is more akin to what Peejers has given us-Azriel 20/9/2014
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Re: All New Who

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Wed Jun 20, 2018 12:35 am

{{  It seems one extreme or another with Who and the BBC- they gave way, way too much away about Capaldi's final series, giving away the big twist in the final episode in the trailer following the 1st episode for example! Mad (if you plan on watching and haven't yet- avoid all the 'next time' trailers in series 10!) with Chibnall's run its the opposite- its been a very slow drip feed of information- and as you point out Malick most of what we do know comes from leaks not official releases of information- in fact the only official stuff we have is the main cast, amount and running time of episodes, some episode titles, a not very impressive directors list and that Chibnall is showrunner- that's it.
By this point in Capaldi debut series production they were on a world tour promoting the show, doing interviews, making announcements and releasing official promos pics of the 12th Doctor and Clara- we've had none of that this time out- its all been very low key and very quiet so far- maybe that will all change after Comic-Con (which was just 1 stop of many globally during 12's promo tour for the show), but I'm not convinced it will.}}}

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Re: All New Who

Post by Forest Shepherd on Wed Jun 20, 2018 3:13 am

My cousin and his girlfriend is going to Comic-con; I bet they see this panel.

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Re: All New Who

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Wed Jun 20, 2018 2:40 pm

{{lucky sods- I expect you to get a full report Forest!!! Nod }}

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Re: All New Who

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:26 am

{{One of my favourite 12/Clara scenes frm the end of Mummy on the Orient Express }}


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Re: All New Who

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Thu Jun 21, 2018 6:50 pm

{{{ Well we might know next to nothing about series 11, we might not have had so much as a teaser trailer for it yet, we might not even know who is writing any of it- but that hasn't stopped BBC Marketing from putting the series 11 Bluray and DVD up for pre-order sale on Amazon- at a whopping £50!!! Shocked  (previous series have been £25-£30 tops) }}

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Re: All New Who

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Sat Jun 23, 2018 6:12 am

The Doctor, Memory, Self and Moffat


{{{ Who, and Moffat era Who in particular is a show that is at heart optimistic. It might hide this fact pretty well behind its misery, deaths at alien hands and childhood fears but in the end, no matter the personal price, the Doctor always wins by doing the right thing. Even in the bleakest moments there is hope. Doctor Who is no stranger to Tolkien's u-catastrophe.

But that is not to say that it does not also deal in themes which are of themselves not optimistic at all. And for me the main feature of Moffat's time as Head Writer are the themes associated with memory, self and its association with mental health, particularly dementia.

The notion here is to demonstrate where those themes surface, what they say about the characters, and to try to extract somewhat what they may say of the author and the overall message conveyed across the whole of Moffat's tenure.


The Series 5 Arc

"Who are you?"

"I don't know yet..."

We begin as Moffat did with the 11th Hour and the debut of the 11th Doctor and his companions Amy and Rory.
The Doctor, as is normal post-regeneration, is not sure who he is yet in terms of personality, all he does know is what he always retains through his regenerations the idea of the Doctor and that is who he is. We are also introduced to a plot device that will resurface from now until the very end of 11's time as the Doctor- a crack in time and space. The crack will eventually be revealed to have been caused when the Doctor's TARDIS was made to explode as a means of preventing him going to the planet Trenzalore in his future.
The effect of the crack is to 'eat' at existence around Amy as she grows up, swallowing up people from her life so that they never existed in the first place.
Because of this we learn in the final episode of the first series that the reason the Doctor took Amy along when he had claimed 'no reason' (which was a lie*) was because she did not make sense, this young girl living in a huge empty house. The crack had been eating at her life her whole life taking people from it and from existence so not even the memory of them survives.


*An interesting feature of 11 as a Doctor is one of the things Moffat choose to highlight -that the Doctor has not always been honest or reliable and he has often manipulated people for his own ends: “Rule One: The Doctor Lies”.

“You asked me why I was taking you with me, and I said no reason. I lied.”

In this way, in a series whose arc is about memory Moffat makes our main character, our hero, an unreliable source of truth. He deliberately draws attention to it several times in the series and in so doing takes away the certainty for the viewer. Memory is vague and uncertain, ethereal and it can be lost or found. By not allowing the viewer to even fully trust the Doctor's words Moffat plays into the uncertainty theme around memory.

"Remember what I told you when you were seven."

"I remember you. I remember! I brought the others back, I can bring you home, too. Raggedy man, I remember you, and you are late for my wedding!"

Amy however has a sort of super power, thanks to the crack being in her bedroom the universe has been pouring through her head every night as she slept, she alone has the ability to remember those whom the crack has taken and so can restore them.
This hinges on a sentiment expressed by the Doctor-

"People fall out of the world sometimes, but they always leave traces. Little things we can't quite account for. Faces in photographs, luggage, half eaten meals, rings. Nothing is ever forgotten, not completely. And if something can be remembered, it can come back."

In this way she restores Rory, her own parents and finally the Doctor.
What brings them back is her ability to remember them again.
So we can see how the overall arc of series five is entirely based around memory and how who we are as a person is reliant upon who we remember being. Amy's life has been eaten away not just by the physical loss of those around her and closest to her, but by her inability to even remember that they ever existed in the first place.
Amy can be seen as someone whose memories of familiar faces has been stripped from her by an overpowering outside force (only this being sci-fi that is manifest literately in a physical fashion as the crack and the actual people not just the memory of them being taken from reality). As a metaphor for one of the major effects of dementia however- loss of memory and in particular loss of the ability to remember or recognise loved ones - it is quite a strong one I believe.

But lets delve a little deeper into some of the individual episodes of series five before moving onto series 6.




The Beast Below

“But why would I choose to forget?

“Because everyone does. Everyone chooses the Forget button.”

The second episode in 11 and Moffat's run tells the story of the starship UK, following massive sun-flares which temporary rendered earth uninhabitable (bit of continuity with 4th Doctor Ark in Space and The Sontaran Experiment classic fans!) the nations of earth each built massive spaceships for their population to go off to try to colonise somewhere else, presumably less on fire.
The UK had some problems with their ship however and they were last to leave (possibly due to problems with Scotland who demanded their own ship, one of many Scottish jokes/commentaries Moffat makes in his tenure but best left for a different discussion!).
As a result the UK was about to get burnt up, crying children and all, when a seeming miracle occurred. The last of the massive star whales turned up- seeing an opportunity the desperate Brits captured it and enslaved it as basically their engine, and they keep it flying for them through permanent torture direct to its brain.
This act of cruelty to save themselves is something the entire population is complicit in, and every five years they go to a booth, watch a tape that tells them what they have done and get to chose- they can protest the fact (if enough do the whale is released they all die) or they can choose to forget and have their memories wiped and so live happy without the burdensome knowledge of knowing how they were safe.
Naturally, everyone chooses to forget.

Again the topic of this episode has a lot to do with memory. In this case though rather than personal memory it is wider social memory- how society can wilfully forget its own misdemeanours, only to repeat them over and over again.
The ultimate symbol of UK society is of course the Queen- and here we have Liz 10, who roughly every ten years of her reign uncovers the sinister evil at the heart of her government, leading her back to where she started, to a tape in which she explains how she gave the order. Every ten years even the Queen chooses to Forget.

The only solution to the dilemma of either releasing the Star Whale and killing everyone on board, or letting it continue on in continual pain under torture that the Doctor can see is to lobotomise the creature, allowing it to continue but to feel nothing again as it would be in a vegetative state.
Again here we are dealing with the idea of self and of its destruction and how that is worse even than killing it would be-

“Then I find a new name because I won't be the Doctor.”

The idea of taking away the star whales individuality, its mind is so abhorrent to him that he would no longer consider himself the Doctor.

The episodes ends on the introduction of a note that will be a hallmark of both Moffat's incarnations of the Doctor and which he often links to memory, or at least the retaining of it over a long period of time distilled to wisdom.

“If you were that old, and that kind, and the very last of your kind, you couldn't just stand there and watch children cry.”

Moffat will continue to link the idea of kindness, with longevity, loneliness, memory and to the Doctor's actions until the very end of his run in charge.



Victory of the Daleks


“He talked to us about his memories. The Great War.”

“Someone else's stolen thoughts, implanted in a positronic brain. Tell me bout it. Bracewell. Tell me about your life...Tell me, and prove you're human.”

On initial appearances this one is not going to deal much with memory, but in the end it hinges upon it.
Bracewell, the Dalek human-impersonating android implanted with a dead man's memories is also a huge bomb. The solution to disarming it is to make him human.
What's interesting here is that the process of doing so is not physical, that's not what counts. What counts is memory.
Moffat begins here another theme which reoccurs till the end of his tenure- that of our idea of self being dependent upon our memories of self, and that is the most important factor to him. It can even override the reality of the fact Bracewell remains an android with a bomb in him- all that has changed is that he embraces his humanity through his stolen life's memories.
Moffat says to us here that though we may change as we live our life, go through different phases, hold differing even opposing view at different times in our lives, it is the culmination of memory of all those variations on ourself that makes the whole self we are in the present, the human we are. And that even if you're an android, if you have those memoires, if you have that recall of all the selves you have been, that is what makes you human, not the wiring. Were memory not imbued with this special power to bestow self Bracewell would have exploded taking the planet with him.
But through embracing the memories of a life lived and accepting them as his own Bracewell becomes self, he becomes human according to Moffat in all the ways that really matter- and those ways are based on the power of memory to define ourselves as an individual.


There are two other more minor touches on the memory issue- we learn that the crack in time is not only eating at Amy's life but entire world events- as Amy has no knowledge of Daleks despite them having invaded earth several time in 10's run. But I view this more as an opportunity by Moffat in a technical way to use the cracks in time as an excuse to 'tidy' up the RTD era 'everyone on earth knows all about aliens and gets invaded every xmas' problem and hit the reset button on that rather than as any particular commentary on memory.
And secondly it could be argued that the Daleks entire plan relies upon memory- specifically the Doctor's. They need him to call them out as Daleks as they require his testimony to convince their systems they are Daleks, as they are not pure DNA Daleks.
In essence the Daleks need the Doctor to remember who they are, what they've done to him and to bring to bear the emotional effects of those memories into him losing it and calling them out as Daleks. In fact the testimony the Daleks take includes him listing past memories of them-

"You are everything I despise. The worst thing in creation. I have defeated you time and time again. I've defeated you. I sent you back into the Void. I saved the whole of reality from you. I am the Doctor. And you are the Daleks."

The rebirth of pure DNA Daleks and the beginning of the new Dalek Empire we see grow across Moffat's tenure can be blamed feasibly on the Doctors memory. Had he say had some sort of memory wipe making him forget all about Daleks their plan would have failed right there and then- it required his memory of them and associated feelings to work.




I had meant to do this piece as one, but its onto page four and I've only got to episode 3!!! So I shall return to it later if there is any show of interest in me doing so! (or probably even if there isn't! Mad  ) }}}}

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Re: All New Who

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Mon Jun 25, 2018 4:45 am

{{part two- guess it was the latter option!! Evil or Very Mad




The Time of Angels/Flesh and Stone


I'll deal first and briefly with River here, as she is a topic on her own. But as far as memory is concerned it is interwoven into her narrative. As a general rule every time she meets the Doctor its a younger version of him, or as she puts it-

Every time we meet, I know him more, he knows me less. I live for the days when I see him, but I know that every time I do, he'll be one step further away.”

What's interesting about this relationship from the perspective of River, and from the the theme of memory and its loss and dementia, is that River here is in the position of loved one not sufferer; watching someone slip every further away from her.

And the day is coming when I'll look into that man's eyes, my Doctor, and he won't have the faintest idea who I am. And I think it's going to kill me.”

This is a moment faced by many loved ones of those suffering from dementia. This is that loss of memory of those closest to you, but from the other side. Rivers greatest fear as that he will have completely forgotten her, have no idea who she is or what she means to him and she knows that moment is inevitable, lying in wait for her in her future.

Moffat also plays games with memory and River, and the order of events. Memory can be remembered in the wrong order in a way reality cannot, unless you write Doctor Who. Immediately following the events of these two episodes River leaves to visit Amy again, only this Amy is several years older and knows who River is, the memory of the sequence of events between River and Amy is dependent on which character's memory you look at. For Amy her encounter with the Angels and meeting River for the first time happened early in her travels with the Doctor, for River it was one of the last adventures she went on with Amy, and she was seeing her for one of the last times.

Regards memory in this episode we have the reappearance of the Cracks in Time and a restating of how it works and a show of that with the soldiers being wiped from existence one by one and forgetting each other. This more a narrative need to demonstrate the power and effect of the cracks than it is any particular comment on memory.
However we also have the Doctor, from the future, speaking to Amy, who thinks its her contemporary Doctor and who tells her to remember what he told her when she was seven.
This is one of those cases where Moffat both plays with memory and the ordering of it- as from the Doctor's point of view he has yet to tell her anything when she was seven- form Amy's point of view ti was a conversation she had twelve years ago.
This device of mixing memory and time gives a sense of the fluidity of memory and its fragile nature as well as how memory lacks order outside of the individual whose memories they are. It keeps the viewer guessing as well as maintaining a sense of uncertainty about events, their order and even reliability.

Vampires of Venice

There is not much on memory here until the very end. In this case its the burden of memory, a common theme in Moffat era when memory is related to the Doctor. In the Doctor Moffat gets to examine this other aspect of memory, especially long memory of a person who has done a lot of good and bad things, that is the burden of memory for the Doctor- a theme Moffat will return to often.

At the end of this story, having defeated his opponents with only one survivor left, the final survivor chooses suicide with the words-

Tell me, Doctor. Can your conscience carry the weight of another dead race? Remember us. Dream of us.”



The Hungry Earth/Cold Blood

This is another story which does not deal directly with memory until the very end.
Here we have the seeming death and removal from existence of Rory by the Crack in Time after he is shot. And as a result a hysterically distraught Amy begins to forget him, eventually forgetting him utterly as he is wiped from having ever existed.
What is interesting about this is the Doctors reaction. He is insistent that Amy can save Rory if only she can somehow retain his memory-

You can. You can do it. I can't help you unless you do. Come on. We can still save his memory. Come on, Amy. Please. Come on, Amy, come on. Amy, please. Don't let anything distract you. Remember Rory. Keep remembering. Rory's only alive in your memory.

Sadly he is completely wrong- just as a dementia sufferer cant wilfully prevent the memory degrading just by trying, nor can Amy. Moments later she has no memory of Rory at all and acts oblivious to him having ever having existed.
Despite the Doctors insistence the force at work is so monumental that it is irresistible. A force a human simply cannot stand up to it no matter how hard they try or well intended they are, or how much support they have. Again this is very metaphorical for dementia- there are a thousand and one programs to help sufferers try to retain memory, exercises to do ect but in the end none of them work long-term in holding out against the damage.


Vincent and the Doctor

Of all series five this episode is the most upfront on its subject matter of mental health. And it bears a resemblance in ideas to the end of Cold Blood in that there is a harsh inevitability about events.
Having believed they have made a positive difference in the life of Van Gogh Amy believes they will have prevented his suicide allowing him to go on and paint more pictures.
What she finds is that despite all they did he still killed himself a year later. There is an acceptance here that the weight of the mental issues is again to great to bear or resist over time, even if there are moments along the way of lucidity, happiness or joy.
As the Doctor puts it-

The way I see it, every life is a pile of good things and bad things. Hey. The good things don't always soften the bad things, but vice versa, the bad things don't necessarily spoil the good things or make them unimportant.


I will leave it here again as the next bit covers the series finale and the xmas special- which is enough ground to cover for a post on its own. }}}

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Re: All New Who

Post by Pettytyrant101 on Mon Jun 25, 2018 4:16 pm

{{This is interesting, its from the official site and its about the glorius 70's Who  of the 4th Doctor (they've got some dvd's to flog) but what caught my attention is that it references the events of Genesis of the Daleks as the first act of the Time War (a war which RTD didn't dream up till 2005). Now this has long been a fan theory as far as I know, but I was unaware it had ever had any official confirmation- until now of course. }}}


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